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S7 goes batshit insane

22K views 213 replies 57 participants last post by  Soopahmahn 
#1 ·


From 33m on is...

 
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#15 · (Edited)
EDIT: I know Jim isn't a scumbag but this is NOT the way to handle complaints or customers.
To date, I've stayed out of the Strictly 7 melee completely and I also know you're a former endorsee, so I'm sure it's a partially sensitive issue, and I'm usually very cautious about saying something like that on a board where it could put people in an awkward position.

That preface out of the way, what Jim did and what he says in this video makes him scum. It's one thing to send out the guitar with the defects, it's another to repeal the agreed upon solution, attack the buyer/victim and essentially issue a verbally combative challenge to them. Even when Jim tries to act like he's humbled by the situation, he keeps implying that the GIANT WORMHOLE shouldn't mean anything. It's bad business and furthermore, it's rude, bullying and SCUMMY behavior.

If he'd had kept his mouth shit and made good on the agreement, I'd bet you anything that the customer would've been asking us (SSO mods) to take down the thread, or amend it, or would've put up a thread talking about how S7 did the right thing and tell everybody to forgive them. Instead, Jim got angry and just reinforced his rightfully earned shitty reputation.

If it were one random person at the company, that'd be one thing. The fact it's the owner is another, and the fact they posted it to the YT profile of ANOTHER guy at the company takes it up another few notches. The video was a piss-poor, wholly inappropriate response to the situation and it's been raised from just a knee-jerk, angry reaction of an individual, to the clear position of the company as a whole.

EDIT: I also find it hilarious that he goes on and on about how the customer ate up 45 minutes of his guy's time on the phone, but apparently it's no big deal for the owner to whine on webcam for an hour. Fuck this guy and fuck this company.
 
#9 ·
TL;DW summary

Small luthier sets up shop focusing on a young and ignorant crowd, gets fed up with ignorance while ignoring or rationalizing his own faults and records a rambling hour long video where he commits commercial suicide.

Only a tremendous fool would send him money after watching this.
 
#12 ·
First BRJ, now this? I know custom guitar making's a high stress job, but they seem to be snapping more than usual. Economy? Trolls? Stupid kids ranting about things they don't have? I don't know what it is, but it ain't helping.

He seems an alright guy but if anyone ever needed a "chill pill", it's him. And I don't think I'd want someone making my guitar who's capable of getting in a state like that, if he's in one when he's making it then it's not going to end well.
 
#48 ·
I think any builder who has been doing this a while becomes a bit nuts. Bill Collings is one of the craziest fuckers I know, but he's pretty awesome still. I work with tons of dudes who are pretty wacky, it's just the nature of the business. Too many paint fumes I think :rofl: It's a tough business, that's for sure.
 
#13 ·
:rofl:

engage757 said:
48 minutes ago
Ok Jim, This is Zack from the Guitar Porn Network. Want to prove this is a great product? We will take it up. You and I pick a few different independent reviewers. Everyone pays their own shipping. You send us a Boden, I will take pro level pics of it, go over with a fine tooth comb, review it and send it to the next person. Everyone can do a video or pics, and write a written review of their thoughts. Let's see how good this product really is. porn_guitar@yahoo.com
 
#27 · (Edited)

^I liked his oil demonstration :lol: To be honest those "dry spot" complaints seemed pretty silly

EDIT: That tuning peg complaint was pretty ridiculous too. Not defneding Jim but it seems like some people don't know what is or isn't a flaw :shrug:. I would be pissed if I was dealing with some of these people as well but that's why I'm working in a different industry :lol:
 
#28 ·
I'm not seeing the drama, though admittedly I only watched about 15 minutes of it from around 33 minutes on. The dude's just being candid, and we all know that people (ESPECIALLY the /7/ crowd) can go fucking bananas on the web when something bad happens with a builder. Plus, it's ALWAYS the mob mentality as soon as any drama comes up.

I have my issues with Sherman, for example, but a lot of his (imo, valid) gripes sound a lot like S7's. If one thing isn't perfect, the company gets dragged through the mud, the /7/ crew explodes and then it's just a snowball effect. The /7/ crowd can be a bunch of miserable, over-entitled fucks when it comes to stuff like this. I'm not saying they're always wrong, but I don't think S7 is at fault here either.

Maybe I'm missing something but this doesn't sound like a BRJ thing to me, it sounds like the natural progression of any builder that gets involved with such a big market. I don't think this video was a particularly good idea, but he's laying it out there and it's his prerogative.

:2c:
 
#29 ·
I'm not seeing the drama, though admittedly I only watched about 15 minutes of it from around 33 minutes on. The dude's just being candid, and we all know that people (ESPECIALLY the /7/ crowd) can go fucking bananas on the web when something bad happens with a builder. Plus, it's ALWAYS the mob mentality as soon as any drama comes up.

I have my issues with Sherman, for example, but a lot of his (imo, valid) gripes sound a lot like S7's. If one thing isn't perfect, the company gets dragged through the mud, the /7/ crew explodes and then it's just a snowball effect. The /7/ crowd can be a bunch of miserable, over-entitled fucks when it comes to stuff like this. I'm not saying they're always wrong, but I don't think S7 is at fault here either.

Maybe I'm missing something but this doesn't sound like a BRJ thing to me, it sounds like the natural progression of any builder that gets involved with such a big market. I don't think this video was a particularly good idea, but he's laying it out there and it's his prerogative.

:2c:
The first 20-25 minutes or so are fine. After that, it's just burning customers and ex-employees live on video and blame shifting. It's pretty ugly.
 
#30 ·
IMO, if he took the high road, than the bigger issue would been the swarming anti-S7 trolls (which I agree are annoying, hence why I've historically stayed out of this).

The fact he made a REALLY bitchy rant video is the issue. That's not how you handle negative PR, especially if that same "bananas /7/" mentality is what you relied on to make sales. :2c:
 
#31 ·
Well, I agree with him about Facebook :eek:

I started my own business in 2008. Can't tell you how many times I've wanted to send an office chair through the window or choke some fuckhead out. I'm pretty sure on some days I've looked exactly like him in that video. The important part is to keep this stuff as "inside" thoughts. Shout fuck after everyone is gone and figure out what you are going to do to fix it. Under no circumstances should you tell your customers to get fucked, your partners to get fucked, the internet to get fucked, some of your ex-employees to get fucked, and I'm broke all your deposit money is gone all in the same video and upload it on Youtube. Congratulations, you just shot your business in the head.

Duncan, Ray, and Chris :metal: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Amy PIHB
 
#33 ·
Watched most of this as background noise. He doesn't seem like a bad dude, just frustrated and at times aloof. But all luthiers are aloof, especially when dealing with a young crowd. That being said, the making and posting of this video was tremendously ill thought out. Even the points I can understand and empathize with (Empathizing with him as a frustrated dude. As a business no one cares about your problems. You exist to provide a service to the customer.) he expressed in such an un concise and rambling manner that it makes him appear incompetent and egotistical. One hour? Is this a PBS Special?

Besides, calling out customers by name is tremendously un professional.
 
#35 ·
Calling the guy out by name is definitely not a great way to get the niche community that you're catering to behind you. :(

I thought the original solution of picking 1 of 12 bodies was a pretty nifty way to go about it, but those two videos are pretty brutal.

But all luthiers are aloof, especially when dealing with a young crowd.
Ermmmm......
 
#37 ·
My S7 is a solid guitar and some of the issues these guy think there having is a joke I'm with Jim on this fuck them. As with the worm hole I can understand that is the guy wasn't happy with that but it sounds like Jim fixed the problem before they went public.
 
#44 · (Edited)
Jim's reaction was crazy obviously, but I feel like that post from Engage and some other SSO members really is just adding to the flames. The whole thing is just ridiculous from both sides.

I sympathize with Jim, because owning a small business sucks. But at the same time you can pretty much track a number of huge mistakes S7 has made as far as marketing and such. Making guitars is pretty fuckin hard, putting out a production line is even harder and when you put that on top of that (i'm pretty sure) Jim didn't have formal Luthier training can make quite a shitstorm.

I think S7 probably could have built a pretty good rep if they didn't put out all those silly signature models, then self promote so much that they ended up taking on more orders than they could really handle. If they just stuck with taking only a few orders at a time and didn't bother with the production models they probably wouldn't be in this situation.

I mean... I don't know what he expected to happen.
 
#47 ·
Jim made some good points in those videos, but he did it in the worst way possible and came off like a jerk.

That second video's not exactly a great marketing tool for Strandberg... :lol:

As for the guitar with the big old knot in the body, there's simply no excuse for that. That's something I'd expect on a 1980s Hondo, not on a $3000 instrument. You'll notice that Jim didn't really try to explain that one away like he did the other problems. His refusal to fix it based purely on a /7/ posting is crap, though. He really ought to rethink that.

In the end, it may be that "production" Strandbergs simply aren't a good idea. The guitar seems too exotic to be produced in real quantity. It'll be interesting to see if Washburn ends up having the same problems.
 
#50 ·
When we get guitars with knots or wormholes that we can't line up with routes we turn the guitar into a factory second. Still gets the same attention to detail but they typically go to artists (who mainly care about what the guitar sounds like of course). They never make it to guitar stores or their customers.



If we can make Collings in the big numbers we make with the crazy amazing woods and strenuous tolerances we use then I think Strandbergs can be mass produced. I'm not sure Washburn is the best company to do it either though. I honestly think Jim is in way over his head, he's tried to ramp up way too fast.

Also, I saw this video posted this morning on the S7G Facebook page but didn't get to watch it. It's set to Private now... Anyone who downloaded it care to put it up on Dropbox for me?
 
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