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Have you owned a modeller?

  • I own a modeller and it's good enough for me. It's the foundation of my main rig.

    Votes: 26 44.1%
  • I own one but use it for effects only.

    Votes: 3 5.1%
  • I own one and use it only for effects but I plan to start using amp modelling in the near future.

    Votes: 1 1.7%
  • I own one but it's not part of my main rig.

    Votes: 10 16.9%
  • I owned one for less than 3 months but it didn't do it for me.

    Votes: 1 1.7%
  • I owned one for more than 3 months but it didn't do it for me.

    Votes: 7 11.9%
  • I tried some but they didn't do it for me.

    Votes: 4 6.8%
  • I've never owned or tried one.

    Votes: 1 1.7%
  • I own a modeller but I'm going back to the real thing. I've owned it less than 3 months.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I own a modeller but I'm going back to the real thing. I've owned it more than 3 months.

    Votes: 6 10.2%
1 - 8 of 8 Posts

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I've owned various Line6 amps, as well as one of the Hughes & Kettner Zen Terras, back when I went through my "modeler phase". I figured I could get a range of good sounds, cop about any tone I wanted, and have a simpler (built-in effects), more reliable rig. Boy, was I ever wrong, since every single Line6 amp I ever owned was in the shop at some point, unless I felt like selling it broken. Now, the only Line6 stuff I own is a X2 wireless, which was broken out of the box. Mike has one, too, and the instrument cable on it died within two weeks. Line6 quality control is just plain shitty, I know tons of guys who have their stuff let them down, and there is no way I would rely on their amps for a gig ever again. It's just not pro level stuff.

Someone offered me a straight up trade, his JCM900 SL-X for the H&K, and I took it, thinking it would be easier to flip. Plugging into that was like the heavens opening up and shining on you, and if you think that about a friggin' JCM900, then you know you have been too long without a real amp. :lol:

Tubes just sound better, and more importantly, they feel better. A tube amp is dynamic and responsive, and you can feel it push back against you when you back off, and give in when you slam into it. My Mesa inspires me to play my best, and when we recorded the Division album direct, with modelers (to be re-amped later) for monitoring, Mike and I had a really hard time getting into that comfort zone. Keep in mind that I work in IT, I embrace modern technology, and I really, really wanted to like the modeling stuff. I gave it more than a fair shake, trying lots of different stuff, and spending the better part of a year gigging 2-3 a month with it. I liked it at home, but it just didn't hold up in the real world.

I even spent some time with an AxeFX over at Chris' (jacksonplayer) house, and while it was way better than anything else, I still knew it wasn't for me. It sounded a hell of a lot better, but the stiff feel was still there. Since then, Chris has picked up a Mesa Quad preamp and an isolation cab for home recording, since he expressed many of the same concerns I did. However, I will concede that Cynic sounded fantastic with them live, so it is brutally obvious why so many guys are ditching their PodXT Lives for them. The Line6 stuff might as well be sold at Toys R' Us.

I know I probably just stepped on a lot of toes with this, and if you can get your sound out of a modeler, then more power to you. For me, I just know there is no substitute for the real thing, and at this point, I doubt there ever will be.
 

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While I can agree that tubes are far more responsive and articulate (which is why I have a proper high gain 3 channel tube amp on the way for my recording rig to replace my POD as the recording rig/dongle for POD Farm), I find your "It's just not pro level stuff" claim to be a little over the top.
Meshuggah relied on it for many years, touring around the world. If it wasn't "pro quality" I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have used it for so long.
Their bass player STILL relies on the POD XT and you know what ? When I saw them live a few weeks ago, his bass tone absolutely destroyed the other two bands that used real bass amps mic'd up.
Yes, they did move onto the Axe FX for guitar tones (which mind you, sounded AMAZING that same night I went to see them) but the POD stuff isn't always bad and doesn't always break down for everyone.
I've never tried the Axe FX personally (not that easy too being an Australian, it's much harder to find guys who own one here), but I imagine I'd feel the same as you. Pretty close to a real amp, but no cigar
Ever notice Meshuggah toured with three Vettas each? The damn things were always breaking. Think what you want, but Line6 is just not up to par. It has nothing to do with them being modelers, and everything to do with them being thrown together half-assed out of shitty parts, and then barely getting any QC. I guess that is fine if you are Meshuggah, since the company just gives them to you for free.

You yourself said they moved onto the AxeFX, and I'm pretty sure I know the reason why. It is the same reason everyone was leaving Krank for Engl.
 

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Hmm, hate ALL of Loomis' tones?
He's had plenty of different tones throughout the years.
This Godless Endeavor certainly sounds a fair bit different to Dead Heart In a Dead World or Enemies of Reality (or indeed his solo album)
I find it strange one could hate every single tone he's had, despite having had a fairly diverse range of tones.
Surely there's some in there that you like, or at least, hate less than others?
Like Mike said, I'm only talking about his live tone on the Godless tour. Those Kranks sounded absolutely abysmal, even if Jeff's playing went a long way towards getting the most out of them. His studio tone has always been something else.
 

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I do buy the 'tone in hands' bit. Sure, you're not going to take a Telecaster through a Twin and get a death metal tone, but I always sound a bit like me no matter what I'm playing through. There are also guys who make my rig sound way better than I do, but in a different way than I can, despite the identical guitar and signal chain/settings.
This. Yes, you amp sound can change, but you are still fundamentally you tonally, no matter what. There are certain guys I can recognize right after the first lick or two. For example, I never knew Stevie Ray Vaughn played an acoustic tune on a 12-string, until I heard "Life By The Drop", but I knew it was him with the lick he played to start the song. Loomis definitely has a signature sound, and whenever he takes a lead, there is that same aggressive attack, pushed on top of the beat immediacy, and stinging pick attack that is his hallmark.
 

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I'd say that's a style, not a tone. Your hands affect your tone, i agree, but you're not gonna make a recto sound like a marshall or whatever. Yeah, you'll sound like you, but you aren't going to change the signature characteristics of your amp and other devices in your signal chain.
Actually, I think of it as both. I know when Mike picks up my guitar and plugs into my rig, it sounds different. That is the part of your tone that comes from the way you pick the strings. There is no changing that. I agree, though, that you're not going to change the signature characteristics of an amp, and a great example of that is the difference between "No More Color" and "Mental Vortex". The sound on both of them is pure Tommy Vetterli, even though you can tell he replaced the Marshall with a Mesa.

I think the whole "tone in your hands" explanation came as a response to people who, say, went out and bought a hotrodded Plexi and an Explorer, and then wondered why the sound nothing like James Hetfield. People are always willing to fix their gear, but rarely willing to fix their playing.
 

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Well, I'm currently building a massive multilayer multisample wavetable triggered by MIDI (from the guitar-to-MIDI systems and computer server rack MIDI datastream)... but I'm guessing the average dude with the ethic of "4/5-guys with 3-amps & a drumkit" don't roll the same way we do at camp Surfacing. :lol:
Yeah, that is completely not for me at all. It is not even an ethics thing as much as "4-5 guys with 3 amps and a drumkit" ALWAYS sound bigger and badder than the guys dragging SkyLab up on stage with them. I've just yet to see a band that does all sorts of complicated stuff sound as good live as a solid backline will provide.
 

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This Godless Endeavor AND Doomsday Machine were two tracks of Dual Recto and 2 tracks of Krank.
The Krank would have sounded like garbage on it's own, but the whole point is the the two tones blend together to create something unique
Considering that Andy Sneap is a Krank endorser, as was Michael Amott and Jeff Loomis at the time, I seriously doubt a word they have to say on the subject. :lol:
 

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Just because you own a tube amp, doesn't immediately mean you have awesome tone. I've seen plenty of live bands with shitty tone from nice amps. Hell, Dave Mustaine's live tone has sucked for years. Actually, so has his recorded tone. :lol:

I've seen a couple of bands around here where the guys are jumping onstage with MacBooks and doing all sorts of complicated stuff. While they obviously had it figured out, and it allowed them to layer all sorts of stuff to get this really complex sound, it still didn't sound as good as a quality tube amp moving a bunch of air. There is something special that happens when you put a microphone in front of speakers driven by glass bottles, and until technology gets you 100% of the way there, I won't ever make the switch. 99% just doesn't cut it.

I saw Nevermore's Kranks blow Evergrey's PodXT Lives completely out of the water. Fundamentally, they were actually getting better tones out of the Line6 stuff, since Kranks just sound god-awful. However, they still sounded artificial. There is this indescribable "plasticness" to the sound of a modeler that I simply cannot un-hear.

Actually, some of the best bass parts I have ever heard are direct to board. Something about bass works better than running through an amp, or even running through modeling.
 
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