[Nolly]

Hey guys, I am currently mixing Essence.'s debut full-length "The Defining Elements". Here is a short sample of one of the tracks, "Revelations". The mixing process is very much still in the early stages so everything is subject to change!
It's been a really nice project to work on - everything has been recorded very tight and clean by the band themselves. :metal:



If you dig it, you can go check them out on Facebook at: ESSENCE. | Facebook

 

[Professor Squidbeard]

Do you ever get sick of hear fake drums? Do you ever yearn for drum tracks with cymbal bleed and human velocity and timing?

I can't make my fake drums sound as good as yours but I tend to prefer the weirdness/realness of a drummer tracked in a room.

this post isn't a stab at using fake drums. just wondering is all.

 

[Nolly]

It's an interesting question, I suppose the answer is it depends entirely on the context. In this case I feel like it's exactly the correct context for this kind of approach. If it were tracked on an acoustic kit it would be quantized and replaced the hell and back anyway, and plus the drummer in this band is pretty damn mechanically tight anyway:

If it were a style where a more open/natural mix and approach was viable then of course I would prefer to work with a real kit to get a unique and "unrepeatable" performance/sound.
For this mix though, I get a kick out of hearing the intensity and tightness that the heavily sampled sound gives.

FWIW, I'm not sure if these drums were tracked on an e-kit or programmed, but there is actually some push and pull/velocity variation going on, especially on the overheads and fills.

 

[Professor Squidbeard]

nice, that drummer has great control. very nice sounding fills.

 

[angelvivaldi]

It's an interesting question, I suppose the answer is it depends entirely on the context. In this case I feel like it's exactly the correct context for this kind of approach. If it were tracked on an acoustic kit it would be quantized and replaced the hell and back anyway, and plus the drummer in this band is pretty damn mechanically tight anyway:

Drum Promo - Steve Vliegen - YouTube

If it were a style where a more open/natural mix and approach was viable then of course I would prefer to work with a real kit to get a unique and "unrepeatable" performance/sound.
For this mix though, I get a kick out of hearing the intensity and tightness that the heavily sampled sound gives.

FWIW, I'm not sure if these drums were tracked on an e-kit or programmed, but there is actually some push and pull/velocity variation going on, especially on the overheads and fills.

I'm with the Squid on this. If the drummer's mechanically good enough, I just don't see the sense in going the digital route. I've heard plenty of heavy/tight/intense sounding bands that used a real drummer.

Besides, who says that every hit needed to be replaced/sampled? I personally miss the authenticity/raw power in drum sounds these days. If I can help it, I will always go with a real drummer.

 

[Nolly]

I'm with the Squid on this. If the drummer's mechanically good enough, I just don't see the sense in going the digital route. I've heard plenty of heavy/tight/intense sounding bands that used a real drummer.

Besides, who says that every hit needed to be replaced/sampled? I personally miss the authenticity/raw power in drum sounds these days. If I can help it, I will always go with a real drummer.

That's all well and good when there is a decent budget behind the production. I'd much rather hear powerful sounding "fake" drums than crappy sounding natural ones
In this case, I am just the mixing engineer. The band made their decisions about how they wanted to record the tracks and told me how they want the end product to sound.

 

[Professor Squidbeard]

this thread is going a way i didn't want it to. the drums sound fine and fit exactly in with the genre. i just notice this is a recurring thing with nolly because he works in this genre a lot. everyone play nice.

 

[angelvivaldi]

That's all well and good when there is a decent budget behind the production. I'd much rather hear powerful sounding "fake" drums than crappy sounding natural ones
In this case, I am just the mixing engineer. The band made their decisions about how they wanted to record the tracks and told me how they want the end product to sound.

My views are more directed to the entire production world in general, not you per say. Obviously you can only work with what you got, just seems that bands are taking the lazy way out as opposed to making a record with some real playing on it. I also find that many people who mix are just generally intimidated by mixing a real kit.

I dont think the budget matters much, as I've been able to record live drums for all 3 of my CDs (and lord knows I'm fucking broke lol). Sequencing drums takes longer than just having a solid drummer play them, (that's if the band hasnt already sequenced them before hand). As long as the drummer can play to a click and the kit's mic'd properly you should save time if anything.

this thread is going a way i didn't want it to. the drums sound fine and fit exactly in with the genre. i just notice this is a recurring thing with nolly because he works in this genre a lot. everyone play nice.

Nolly's my boy- No hard feelings or negative vibes in any way from my end! :wub: The mix sounds good overall. Just wanted to bounce some opinions on drum tracking and the reasoning behind going certain routes

 

[Seanbabs]

I think it sounds great. Really not much more to be said other than it is badass.

 

[Reverend 7 Strings of Hate]

just seems that bands are taking the lazy way out as opposed to making a record with some real playing on it. I also find that many people who mix are just generally intimidated by mixing a real kit.

I dont think the budget matters much, as I've been able to record live drums for all 3 of my CDs (and lord knows I'm fucking broke lol). Sequencing drums takes longer than just having a solid drummer play them, (that's if the band hasnt already sequenced them before hand). As long as the drummer can play to a click and the kit's mic'd properly you should save time if anything

i think it comes down to budget. and while it does take longer to sequence drums, you can go into the studio with the drums finished. Then just drop the midi files into different drum programs.

in a tight, fast style of music, i like the fake drums. if your going for an organic and textured style, obviously real drums are going to be better

from nollys perspective, i'd be happy hearing ANY drums, because it means a little bit of a paycheck in this case:lol:

 

[angelvivaldi]

from nollys perspective, i'd be happy hearing ANY drums, because it means a little bit of a paycheck in this case:lol:

THIS. And it's def less of a headache when bands come in prepared, no doubt. I just prefer the real thing all the way around, :::Ends drum tracking convo::: lol

Will you be mastering this bad boy, as well?

 

[Nolly]

Hahah, no problem, I genuinely don't mind the real vs sampled drum discussion - it's something I certainly encounter all the time and it's always interesting to hear different perspectives on

Angel, yep, I'll be mastering it, though I always feel that to call what I do "mastering" is a bit of an affront to the work a true mastering engineer does, and the experience/knowledge they have. Basically I'll just be making it loud :lol: It will probably end up very similar to what's in this clip.

 

[stealthtastic]

Wirelessly posted (A Destroyer of short people: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

Sounds stupid awesome as always, do you have a site for the production stuff you do? It would be cool to see all the stuff you've done before and compare it to now.

 

[Nolly]

Sounds stupid awesome as always, do you have a site for the production stuff you do? It would be cool to see all the stuff you've done before and compare it to now.

Cheers man!
Sure, just browse through on my soundcloud, it goes back about 18 months (and reveals some fairly cringeworthy production but hey!) I wouldn't really want to publicise the stuff I was doing before then because it sucked hard hahah

 

[AcidWing]

Cheers man!
Sure, just browse through on my soundcloud, it goes back about 18 months (and reveals some fairly cringeworthy production but hey!) I wouldn't really want to publicise the stuff I was doing before then because it sucked hard hahah

Well you gotta start somewhere, right?

Anyways man, this mix is sick and metal as fuck! Kick ass :metal:

 

[Wookieslayer]

Mix sounds ace as per usual! That drummer is awesome btw.