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Ungodly gain with 6505+, please don't crucify me, unpopular opinion content

3K views 18 replies 13 participants last post by  Leon 
#1 ·
Okay so I've had my 6505+ for awhile and I've been running the gain with a boost on 4.5 on the lead channel. Now that's always sounded good, but it never got me quite the crunch like the guys from Chimaira had, which is what I want from that amp. I saw a video that Rob did, and he's got his gain at 8, with EMG's and no boost pedal. Now I tried that and while it's too much, I did turn it to 6.5-7 without a boost and suddenly I was in the kind of really crunchy territory that I love. Now... I get it, most people are going to say here that that's way too much gain, but for me I feel it's about right. Does anyone else run their gain on these amps higher than most people would probably want or need?
 
#2 · (Edited)
I haven't used a 5150 really but I get what you're saying. you're using more than what's typically recommended but if you like how it sounds, let it rip man. i think too much distortion is only a real problem when you're going for a particular sound and having too much distortion is actually making that impossible. if you need the gain to be at 6 or 7 to get the sound you're looking for then that's what you need. Someone on here is always saying "set everything to 6 for a good starting point" I think it was Chris. thats not far from your 6.5 - 7 you're liking it at...

Ola did a tone vid a little while back and ended up putting like a metalzone in front of a rectifier. sounds like too much gain and it probably is but the sound was still ultra gnarly.
 
#3 ·
Gain is so subjective.

Without a boost, a 6505+ is perfectly fine with the gain on 7/8. In fact my 5150 II settings (sans boost) were exactly that. Any less and I don't feel like it had adequate saturation. With a boost doing the work I had it on 4.5 too.

Rob Arnold uses an EMG 81, which can be pumped through an ungodly amount of gain and still remain defined. After a certain level of gain on a 5150 it's not getting any more saturated, it's just filling it out more. I guess he bumps the gain that little extra because it thickens the sound out where the 81 takes it away.

To that end, the relationship between gain and bass on a valve amp is particularly intertwined. You can afford to roll out some bass if you're piling on the gain. Otherwise things get mushy.
 
#4 ·
Crank that shit dude! Funny you bring it up cause I've actually been planning on making a video addressing this topic. Dime your knobs, scoop your mids, do whatever you must to get the sound you want to achieve. I think it comes down to what inspires you. If you like the sound of more gain in your tone then crank it, you're gonna be more inspired when it comes to writing crushing riffs and that will translate in your performance when recording. There are no rules. I think the issue of using "too much" gain comes down to the tone isn't sitting right in the mix or notes are getting muddy. And honestly I think all of this surgically EQ'd, dry, "perfect" guitar tone crap has gotten out of hand. It's boring. I want my guitar tone to sound dangerous. If it becomes an issue when recording, track a DI alongside your regular tone and then you have the option to re-amp with a lower gain tone. Don't let the tone police dictate how you thrash.
 
#5 ·
Something else I should bring up. I use a Boss SD-1 as a boost when I do boost, but I'm really liking the lead channel unboosted. Also, the SD-1 has a tendency to make it tight, but actually sounds like it reduces some gain whereas my TS-9 seemed to tighten it up, but make it chunky. Anyone else have that experience?
 
#6 ·
I used to boost my 6505+ with a ST9pro+ and enjoyed it for awhile, but I always reverted back to plugging straight in. Then I got a Bogner Uberschall and it was all over. I plug straight into that too. I haven't been a fan of boosting with overdrives for the past few years now. If you really wanna get crazy, throw a MXR 10 band EQ in the loop and put a nice smiley curve on the settings...insane old school high gain death metal tones right there.
 
#8 ·
Everything the guys said, no boost, crank it up. I thought the same thing as you about everyone saying use lower gain then I realised in many cases they where coming from a recording mindset, where they are layering tracks and generically the "use lower gain" thing happens. Also, depending on if your amp cuts through live or gets burried, years and years ago I found that with the crappy amp I used that the less gain I used the more I stuck out, but that was a true POS of an amp.

5150s cut through concrete, crack that gain!
 
#10 ·
I also happen to be one of those guitarists who uses more gain than a lot of people recommend, but it is on a case by case thing. I tend to think that most amps sound better with a boost, but some either don't need a boost or (in my humble opinion) actually sound better without a boost. For example, I feel like all Mesa Boogie amps need a boost, but I feel like most ENGL amps sound fine (or even better) without a boost.

The recommendation I've heard a lot of people say of putting the gain around 4 might work if you stack a boost on top of it, but depending on the amp, that's way too little gain without a boost and maybe a bit lacking with a boost. I find that a good starting point is 6 o'clock, and usually it's fine there or needs to be increased a bit. I almost never lower the gain below 6 o'clock (assuming we're talking about a high gain rhythm sound).
 
#11 ·
Dude, every time I watch Ola Englund play a rectifier, he has the modern channel gain maxed out and he sounds awesome. There's no way I'd ever turn the gain on one of those things past 2 o'clock, so consider that everyone's sound may vary on everything from how hard you hit the strings to the pickups you play. I later found out that other than his Dimebag guitars, Ola prefers mid-output pickups while I like them super hot, so that's one factor in the difference. Everything in the chain matters, and don't worry what someone else may say like you're using too much or too little gain or whatever. I **always** make it a point to turn knobs in ways that you're not supposed to, and many of my recordings have unorthodox methods that just absolutely work for me, because I took the time to experiment with settings and ideas that were not normal.

Ultimately you need to play what's inspiring to you to make new and better music. If that's the gain at 6 instead of all the way up, awesome! If it's running a chorus and delay with an MT2 and 6 compressors before the gain channel with no gate and the volume on 10 slaved into a plexi on full blast, awesome. Whatever works for you to inspire you to create new music and enjoy yourself.
 
#13 ·
IIRC I ran mine at 6-7 on my 6505MH, and boosted it, too. Like everyone else said, if it lights your fire, strike the match.
 
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